Re-defining Normal
On Re-Defining Normal, we are having conversations to question conventional thinking and talk about the courage it takes to create, and live, a deliciously vibrant life.
This podcast is for people who know there's a better way to do life and love....how we show up in connection to others, our kids, our partner, our business... and beyond that our relationship with money, vitality and more than anything, ourselves.
We're two shamelessly unapologetic moms choosing to experience the fullness of life and we're collapsing the conditioning that says you can't live a life of pleasure, peace and abundance in the midst of the mundane of work, life and kids.
Re-defining Normal
Connecting Mind and Body for Better Relationships
Ever wonder why certain relationship patterns keep replaying in your life? Join us on Redefining Normal this week as we uncover the deep-seated roots of our attachment styles and how they shape our interactions with loved ones. Jamie kicks off with a heartfelt story of a recent breakup, shedding light on how our childhood experiences influence whether we become anxiously attached or avoidant in our adult relationships. Together, we navigate these familiar yet often toxic patterns, emphasizing the significance of self-awareness and emotional sovereignty to foster secure, healthier connections.
Our journey continues as we dive into the complex web linking our nervous system to our emotional experiences. Life's curveballs like breakups can send our nervous system into overdrive, but don’t worry—we’ve got practical strategies to bring it back into balance. We discuss the transformative power of breathwork, slowing down, and being present with our bodily sensations. Jamie also explores primal play and physical activities to release stored trauma, underlining the need for safety and awareness when engaging in these profound somatic practices to unlock and integrate deep-seated emotions.
Finally, we turn our focus to the stories our minds craft and their impact on our wellbeing. It's easy to get tangled in narratives that fuel anxiety and conflict. We delve into the art of recognizing these mental traps and redirecting our focus to our bodily sensations, a process that helps us stay grounded and connected. Understanding where our stories manifest physically can prevent unnecessary stress and tension in our relationships. Our conversation wraps up by encouraging a mindful approach to our emotional states, paving the way for more authentic connections. Don't forget to join the conversation on social media or via email and share your experiences with us!
Welcome to redefining normal. Join us as we question conventional thinking and talk about the courage it takes to create and live a deliciously vibrant life.
Speaker 2:This podcast is for people who know there's a better way to do life and love how we show up in connection to others our kids, our partners, our business and, beyond that, our relationship with money, vitality and, more than anything, ourselves.
Speaker 1:We're two shamelessly unapologetic moms choosing to experience the fullness of life.
Speaker 2:And we're collapsing the conditioning that says you can't live a life of pleasure, peace and abundance in the midst of the mundane of life, responsibilities, work and kids.
Speaker 1:Are you ready? Let's do this this week. Jamie and I are super excited to have a conversation with you about something that might sound a little bit boring but I think is really freaking important, which is attachment styles. But we're really wanting to kind of hone in on secure attachment and what that is. Some of you may have heard this before. Some of you may not have heard this before, so we're going to kind of um, take you through this and the importance of this and why we're having a conversation about it right now. So can I actually?
Speaker 2:I'll start and say why we're having the conversation now and then we'll take you through this um through this process, cause I would love for you to share what you like, how you define it, what it means to you attachment, secure attachment.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, first let me just share why we're talking about this and then and then we'll get into the details and the nitty gritties. Uh, so basically, what's going on for me right now is, for those of you I don't know if we've even talked about it that there's been a breakup from the guy, the mystery guy that we've been talking about, and it's been a really intense process because it was really shocking, and we're now at a place where, interestingly enough, we have found our way through to be able to move through in a friendship, and it has taken every ounce of my soul to really work through this on an internal level. And so the reason I'm talking about this is because this was about attachment. So attachment is when we really get into connecting with another human right and it can be other than humans too. When we get out of this, you know this experience but we connect to another human, and there can be other than humans too. When we get out of this, you know this experience but we connect to another human, and there can be attachment styles that are not actually healthy.
Speaker 1:So, basically, it's based on our from the way we were with our parents, whether our parents left us or abandoned us or over cuddled us or all these different ways that we have attached or not attached to a parental figure in life or a person who played as a parent in life, and then how does that play out later on in our relationships, in our we'll just call it for here our relationships, right, and so for me, right now, as I'm going through this journey, as we separate, it's about coming back into this wholeness with myself and creating a deeper level of sovereignty in myself. And Jamie and I were just talking right before, because Jamie has some some really freaking amazing embodiment things, and I was like OK, jamie, I'm at this place right now, I've made it this far, but I'm still feeling really dysregulated in my nervous system, which is how, when we have an anxious experience because we're attached to a human on an anxious level, right it can feel really dysregulating and uncomfortable. Plus, there was this very fast separation. So I'm just moving through, like the separation in and of itself, right, and so now I'm like working on how do I come back into my body in a better way and hold myself and not and be able to stay in peace within myself, because that's an us job, right, and so this is how this conversation started. This is where we're at, jamie.
Speaker 1:Do you want to add into attachment? Do you want to have anything to say?
Speaker 2:because I've just no, I mean, I'm not an expert by any means on like attachment theory and attachment styles. I I, you know kind of vaguely or high level, know um about, you know, like, like, uh, anxious attachment and what that looks like, um, and avoidant yeah, and how oftentimes they end up together. Kyle and I were very much so that I was the anxious one, he was the avoidant, um, and it's interesting because then when I go avoidant he gets um, anxious. You know it's, it's a polarity thing and you kind of need both to play that dynamic and create the tension that feels familiar in our nervous system.
Speaker 2:Like carrie was saying, if you had, you know, a parent that um, yeah, like created those dynamics with you as a child, then they feel familiar and safe in your body. So you look to create them in your romantic relationships or friendship relationships or whatever relationships you've got going on. Um, an anxious attachment, from my understanding, tends to be uh, leaned way forward, right like. I need a lot of time, I need a lot of energy, I need a lot of reassurance, reassurance.
Speaker 2:A lot of text messages, communication, yeah like continual um connection and then avoidant wants their own space, wants you know, like doesn't want to have to um give or receive that um, they want freedom once. Yeah, kind of oftentimes is um what's the commitment? Phobic is like oftentimes the label that would look like with that Right, yeah, and oftentimes those two people find each other, and you know each other's buttons and then create attachment right to the dynamic and oftentimes relatively toxic dynamics in in that relationship.
Speaker 2:So, and I know that I mean, like I said, that was Kyle and I for a good chunk of our marriage and not that we aren't that way ever now. But we are aware when I'm, you know I'm getting anxious or or avoidant and you know it's like we're aware that we're navigating and moving through the various ways that we're showing up for each other yeah, he and I were the same, I was.
Speaker 1:I'm anxious and he's avoidant. Yeah and um, and I think I want to say here to anyone who's listening if you haven't heard this before um, these things it's like, ultimately I don't think they ever, fully, ever go away. I just think that you learn how to be in relationship with them and support each other with love, right, so so there's certain things that is an anxious attachment, that it's just like it becomes normal part of relating to the extent that the other person is willing to like meet you, right, and you can always ask for your needs to be met and then you can always find your way, way through things. And I think also the more that we start to learn, like Jamie and I you know, both are at the place of I can be aware of when I'm being very anxious, like I'm like Ooh, ah, I feel that Carrie and I don't have to do the thing right, I can hold myself. And this is where we start to come into this place of the secure attachment, right, so that we can both notice and go ah, wow, that's your anxious attachment, carrie, and you can, you can even call it like.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I'll even say to my like a partner right, like I'm feeling really anxious right now because of can you reassure this Right? And it's not then coming in this like needy and if they don't, whatever, like it's not being like you're this person, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I need this. And then we're not hooking into each other's energy. And it's like those places, like I know, when I've become into anxious moments, I'm like just hold yourself, carrie, like you don't need that Right.
Speaker 1:And the more that we do that, the more that we do that on either side of this, whether it's in the anxious side, because you know, I experienced this, or the avoidance side, where we want to run, because, definitely with my partners, like sometimes, like it goes all right, well, he wants to run, I want to over-communicate, where's the middle ground, right? Or they want to run and you want to run, but it's like no, we got to sit at the table and figure this out, right. And so we start to look at these places where we're playing into these patterns and we can choose into different ways of doing it. And it starts with our own journey, with ourselves in choosing to have this awareness right, like if you guys again, neither jamie nor I are experts in this.
Speaker 2:We are just humans who are on the path and I think too it's important to remember it's a theory and incomplete. You know, like there's lots of different ways this can show up and like, if you identify with anxious, look at where you're avoided like what are you actually like? I don't want to talk about it, I don't want to commit to this, I don't want to because, like in my romantic relationship, I was anxious mostly when I felt he was avoided. Then I wanted to like, lean in and force connection. But then there are lots of arenas where I'm just avoidant and don't want to talk about it, don't want to look at it, don't want to commit to something, don't want to, um, have it, don't want to look at it, don't want to commit to something, don't want to have the conversation, whatever, whatever that is. So, yeah, you can start to understand your partner when you can see where you do that thing and what drives it in you as well.
Speaker 1:I think as well, like just having the awareness, because there's times when, in any intimate relationship, I can go both ways, like if you push me enough, I'm going to fucking avoid in a billion ways, yeah Right. And and then I think, when you know that, like I know, even with with my ex, this last partner like I, we could actually get to the place where I was like if I'm in this place and you see me do this, it's because I went into a free state and in my free state I'm not going to be able to communicate with you unless you actually do these things. Yeah Right, I'm like, it's not because I don't want to, it's not because whatever, but like I'm in a total freeze state. And so then you can also start to learn how do you be in relationship to support each other, to be able to communicate at your best, yeah.
Speaker 1:So I think and like Jamie said, I think this is really important to note that it's like there is no like perfection in this, or there is no like it's not the be all, end all, but the be all, end all.
Speaker 1:But I do think it helps to actually have that awareness because it's not just in our relationships, like I would have an anxious attachment to money.
Speaker 1:I would have you know, like these are these places you can look at your money, you can look at your health, you can look at your own relationship with yourself and where you're doing the same damn thing with yourself Right, and so it can really help. So right now I'm really curious to know Jamie because, like she's like we're like, uh, nervous system. Can we just talk nervous system embodiment things and how we can actually settle when we have these experiences that cause I'm talking about shock in my body, right, and I'm also talking about coming home to self and I think, first of all, both things can happen regardless of you know it was, it was a breakup, but, like, regardless of the situation, we have this and um, and also you don't need shock for it to happen, right, like our nervous systems can get totally dysregulated and we are also can be very again this anxious avoidant attachment. So, even in a marriage 20 years on, if your still nervous system is still going cause mine was.
Speaker 1:Yeah 17 years into a marriage. Mine was way worse than it is now. Well, okay, in this moment it's pretty intense, but generally speaking, yeah Right, yeah Right. So, like these are these things that we can really look at and say how do we come back home and settle this? So go on and tell me some things, help me out here.
Speaker 2:What do you think? Yeah, I mean, I guess it depends on where you're at in your journey. You know, I mean like for you, oftentimes just slowing down, just slowing down. Right, who was it? Kelly Greeno just did like a reel the other day and she was, like, you know, pro parenting tip and she was just walking along at a pace and then she's like slow, slow down, like brush your teeth slower, walk slower, talk slower. You know the semantics of like, like breath work is miraculous in a lot of ways, um, as well as it is. It's interesting because it's like you need to follow the sensations in your body. But your mind has to be a part of the process, because oftentimes we can make the mistake of like, um over intellectualizing things and getting into the story, getting into the but why? And because my dad and because my mom and because you know, like, whatever, and we have left our body in that. But if we can follow the story, that's creating the anxiety or the avoidance, and feel the sensations that are coming up in our life.
Speaker 2:It takes practice to do that, to engage the mind and not let it run away with the story you know. So it. So it's like let it, let it guide the awareness of the sensations that are showing up internally and then to be able to move those to it's it is. It's like an acclimation or a um integration. What were you used a word earlier? Um, like it's a capacity thing.
Speaker 2:You know it's like your nervous system is literally like I don't know what to do with this. It's like a, like a wire that's running too much energy through it. That wants to short circuit, yes, and that we can slowly and intentionally increase our capacity for what needs to move through us. So you know like when we move our bodies, you know, like animals, they shake off.
Speaker 1:Oh, my God, it's been my. By the way, for those of you listening, I have been obsessively loving going to play parties here that are like they're not sex play parties, they're like we get primal in play, and it is so fucking delicious to meet another human in a safe space and I'm and I'm saying this because, like, we have play parties here to do this because I'm a single person and this is something I'm doing right now to actually like literally what you're saying, to move this energy out of my body, and it's so amazing to meet another human in like fierce ferociousness that you're like let's go Right.
Speaker 2:Where else do we do that in life ever? Like most people do not have a space where they can rage, where they can scream, where they can punch hard. You know it's like bite.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't exist, you know, and and actually, so that's what I'm saying. So, like you guys can invite, like I invite you, even if you can look in your areas, like this is I know I'm in denver and it's a boulder area and we have got all this kind of stuff and it's really fucking wicked place to live for this. But look in your areas, you might find it. If you want, reach out to one of us. We might know people in your area that can lead you into these paths. But even still, like, just wrestle with your partner. If you've got a partner right, like and it doesn't, you know like get into those primal places because far out it feels like and be aware that it might bring stuff up.
Speaker 2:You know, like, so I, um, when I was little, my stepdad would like hold me down and tickle me and so, like, the first time, couple times, whatever that I would wrestle and Kyle would hold me down, I would, I would feel so much rage and I'm like like, oh, it's not Kyle, he's bringing up somatic memories that I have not fully processed. So like, it isn't always a pleasant release. Sometimes it will bring stuff up. That's really uncomfortable. But in allowing it to come up and to be felt and to move through, means that you're no longer holding it in your body and trying to navigate normal and be like calm and be felt. And to move through means that you're no longer holding it in your body and trying to navigate normal and be like calm and be centered and have this um, regulated nervous system, while it's trying to hold this trauma that you just haven't acknowledged, you know yeah, yeah it's.
Speaker 1:It's an interesting experience to to have those things move through I think, on that note I want to add here because I did say go, and on that note I want to add here because I did say go and do this. But I think to add a safety piece if you're going to allow yourself the fullness of this right, yeah, if you really truly allow yourself the fullness of this release and you actually have another human in your space that can can meet you in this and who's willing to like go in the wrestle, to go into the primal play, to go into being with you in that space, yeah, um, and like you don't have to be deeply, like my ex did it with me, he did it with me.
Speaker 1:My ex-husband would wrestle and get me like yeah, let's go right, yeah, um, but there's some really great safety things that you can use, which are like in tantra, they use a speed light red, yellow and green. And so the green is like go, like, let's go, we're, we, we're fucking going to go at this and have fun and primally at it. Yellow is like you've hit a point to me where I'm getting to the point of uncomfortable yeah, something's moving, like something's moving, you've triggered something. I'm not sure where I'm at. Slow the fuck down, right. And red is stop, right, fucking here, right.
Speaker 1:And so if you've been triggered, then you get to have those, say, because sometimes there's gonna be nothing else that can come out of your mouth in these moments and, um, it gives you a safe way to play, right, and so you can actually get ferocious, like even if it gets too hard, right, like if you guys are rustling and it gets too hard, you're like, hey, that's an 11, like that's a yellow, stop, hey, right. And so you have a way of communicating. And that's a yellow, stop, hey, right. And so you have a way of communicating and that's a great way to communicate with somebody who isn't aware of.
Speaker 2:I know that, like the first couple of times that and even for me, like the first couple of times, not even just physically but emotionally, things would get triggered, yeah, and all of a sudden I would be angry at Kyle and he's like I don't even. I don't even know what I did, you know, and I had nothing to do with him. But it was bringing up my, my own stuff, and it was through learning, somatics and healing work and mindset work and all of that that I started to realize, oh my gosh, I'm literally projecting my trauma. He's, he's playing the you know, placeholder for the story that has nothing to do with him. And so when we both started to recognize that it allowed us to step out of you know the attachment dynamics we were running yeah, totally so yeah, but animals, like when they, when they have conflict, they shake off the adrenaline, you know, and humans don't do that.
Speaker 2:Uh, it's one of my favorite your body shake, body shake your hips. One of my favorite.
Speaker 1:You'll see me shaking pretty much every day somewhere in my day, and it's interesting because some of the things that you would say as well like breathwork. So for me, quantum flow is my way of doing this and my practice that I use and I teach with my clients as well, and there is like there's so many ways and like stomping your feet, too, can be a really great grounding way to get your stuff out of your, out of your body Something that you said earlier too, by the way, that I wanted to add into. You had said earlier something about the stories in your mind and letting them lead into your body. Yeah, and the thing that I just wanted to add an extra piece to that, because it's something that I've really been working with over the last year. It's been a really important part of my process because I'm a heady story person and Jamie's often pulling me out of the story Carrie, that's a fucking story.
Speaker 2:That's the shadow of my life's work is intellectualizing things, so it's like I'm very familiar with the mind's capacity to take us on a journey. That is nonsense.
Speaker 1:It doesn't actually fucking help anybody, right? So it's been part of my journey, and so one of the things I actually ask myself when I get really into the story and I can notice, just like Jamie said, I noticed that my body gets this. I'm going to call it anxiety, but really it is just energy that's moving right. There is a lot of energy that is in my body that needs to be released, ultimately, or paid attention to or moved in some way, shape or form Right. And so the thing that I'll often think of I'm like oh, notice this right here. So what's the story? Does it really matter what the story is? And this is what Jamie said, but I want to bring this into a really clear point here it doesn't really matter what the story said. You just go okay, where is the story in my body Exactly?
Speaker 1:then where it is in your yeah right, what sensation is this creating? And then, what is it that I need to do to move this out?
Speaker 2:and it sometimes takes a while, the mind will keep trying. The mind will keep like yeah, but this happened. Yeah, but he said, yeah, but you have and then you go back to and then you're right back out of your body.
Speaker 2:I did this last last week, two weeks ago, kyle and I don know, like we were disagreeing on something and we whatever we went our separate ways, did our thing. It wasn't anything major and my body felt fine, like sensation wise. I was like over it, nothing. My mind was like we haven't talked about that thing, he hasn't apologized for that thing, or we haven't decided whatever. And I'm like, wow, my mind is literally trying to take my body out of contentment. Fine, like let's just move on.
Speaker 2:And it's like, no, we need to, we need to fight about this, we need to have conflict, we need to sort it, we need to whatever. And I'm like, wow, she keeps trying to pull me into a story and a dynamic that really doesn't exist, it doesn't have to exist. And my mind is literally creating conflict that does not sensationally exist in my body. And she's powerful. That's what that's like, the process of kind of training your mind to not run away, Because oftentimes that happens. We're like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, wait a second, we didn't resolve this conflict. You know, it's like so easy to go into the story and to stay there, um, and being able to detach from it, being able to recognize.
Speaker 1:This is just thoughts, this is just story it's also interesting because, you know, since we started this on attachment, like hearing you say that to me is really what I'm starting to pay attention to a lot in my mind is where do I give my mind space to other people? Because now I'm attaching to something, or I'm thinking about, or I'm even projecting or like. Sometimes I even think like if I'm trying to work this out and figure this out with them in the space of in between, it's actually hooking into their energy. Yeah Right, it's actually like wow, like how does that feel? Yeah, right, or am I being respectful and so like it's even like okay, is that respectful to even be considering, like you're trying to forward project something that you couldn't possibly fucking know? So shut your mind up. It doesn't even exist, right? Like?
Speaker 2:literally just pretend.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just so interesting, right, but it's part of to me. It is part of that attachment, because we're trying to find an attachment to something to solve a problem, for ourselves to feel better in our bodies, but really what it has to come down to is to come back into our bodies. I know I'm saying this because at some point this is going to be a clip and I'm going to hear it exactly when you need it.
Speaker 2:You're talking to a future, a future, future self, but it's true. So think about this Like we we create story, then we explore all the versions of that story in order to feel prepared for what could potentially happen. Yeah, creating all kinds of conflict, all kinds of potential that do not exist.
Speaker 2:It don't exist. So so it's like, just go in with the right here right now. Let me hold myself and be present and respond or be with whatever wants to happen right now, without trying to preemptively plan for it or, um, figure out what I'm going to say or do. If he does this and if he does that and if that's like, you are creating so much tension and anxiety and stress in your body that that is, pretend it doesn't exist.
Speaker 1:This is literally where I've been and this is literally what Jamie's been with me on. Carrie, stop, I love you, stop Right. But it's so interesting because, even in that, I love you, stop Right. But it's so interesting because, even in that, when I think of my marriage, I think of how far I've come, because because in that, yeah, I did that then too, obviously, but I would even have it planned and like take it into the marriage conversation, right. Whereas now, like, when I come into a conversation with someone, I might have it all and, like Jamie and I, like literally we in this last week, we've had this conversation.
Speaker 1:Why are you thinking about this? Because I want to know what my things are. Her response to me is Carrie, what do you need to know? And this is a really great question what do you need to know about yourself? And so now, what I really come home to in these conversations is what are the things that I need to know that I'm bringing to the conversation that it's like what's important to me? What do I need to be able to share that's important to me?
Speaker 1:yep, right, not about what they are and as long as they want or what they're going to think of it or what, no, but like what's important for me to express, because this needs to be like something for me that's important, yeah, or something that I need, or something that has upset me, or some like boundary that I need to create, whatever that is right and I show up right.
Speaker 2:And I show up doing that.
Speaker 1:And then the conversation. Like you know, we had this conversation. My ex and I had this conversation last night around friendship, and it was really quite a beautiful and easeful conversation. But I can tell you that prior to the conversation, I was literally coming into peace with myself. This was my journey, was like okay, carrie, clear your head. There's no way that you can predict how this conversation is going to go. So come into your heart, open your heart, be present and let it be.
Speaker 2:I wonder if this is a manifestor thing too, because of where you guys are defined. Because I'm just thinking to my other bestie manifestor friend, who will literally have whole conversations, from beginning to end, oh yeah, With someone and make decisions based on this imaginary conversation and never include the other person in the conversation. You've never had that happen before. And then she's like, yeah, he's going to say no, so I'm not even going to ask, and I'm like but you have just eliminated all potential for the thing you want Because you have literally created the whole story before it's ever happened. Does she have a closed head too? She must be defined there. I mean, like our manifestos are defined up top because, yeah, I guess we have to be. So I wonder if that has to do with that, and I can feel it. It's so interesting because we traveled together recently and to watch her go into her head and all the stories and the you know, and, and her voice gets higher and her speech gets faster and her this, and I would be like, okay, come back into your body like ground, back into the here and now, right into your root, and then she'd be like, oh, like her, her voice would deepen, her words would slow down and there was like immediate clarity, you know, like, and then it was like, oh yeah, I don't like, all of that was just chaos. And just to like, come back into the now, completely shift everything. And she had some big chaos to navigate, like she, she missed weird airport thing. They said her flight had departed, it hadn't, so she missed her international flight home, like it was.
Speaker 2:It was a lot for her traveling and straight into like all the stories and all the things and who, who's gonna, you know. And it was like and right now, what's happening? What can we do right now? And to watch her go up and then just to be able to say come back into your body and how, like, almost immediately, like, oh yeah, none of that, like I can't do anything about all of these imaginary stories, right here and right now. What do I need to, what do? What do I want? What do? What am I creating? What action can I take? You know, and think about what life would be like if we navigated from that place more often, totally right here, right now. What's true? What's real? What do I need? What do I want? What am I creating? Not, what ifs, not what could be all.
Speaker 1:It's so weird the way mine does that so, so fucking frustrating to be human sometimes it is yeah, it is, you know. I mean like this whole process, and this is why we're talking. I think this is also the point of, for me, talking about. It is that over this last it's been four or five weeks now. Um, I'm getting to the place where it's been like god, I know mentally what needs to happen and I'm saying this because I think this is a really important piece, right, I know mentally, like I know, and in my body, that doesn't change that I'm less human and it doesn't change that the looping thoughts don't happen and those annoying stories don't happen, and it doesn't mean that there's a grief happening and there isn't heartbreak.
Speaker 1:And right, yeah, abandonment and all these things right because we're still human, yeah, and so I think this is why I want to say, like, bring this here, because if you're going through any of this, like and it happened again, like I said, with any shock, with any way that we attach to things outside of ourselves, right, and then we need to come back home to ourselves, and this happens all the time. We're human, we're going to keep attaching. This is the yeah like.
Speaker 2:This doesn't go away.
Speaker 1:It just becomes easier to spot and move through, but it doesn't go away, yeah um, that you're, you're where you're supposed to be, right, I just want to say that, like you're where you're supposed to be and I've and I'm saying that because I've had to have my friends tell me, like doesn't matter how frustrated I am, and even when I talked to my ex last night, I was like I know that we're going to be in space together because we're in community together and we bit of a Jamie and Carrie style session here.
Speaker 1:I don't know if you have anything else you want to add, actually, but I think we got into a lot of the embodiment things and ultimately I have a I like I totally agree with everything that Jamie has said around our secure attachment and like how we come back to ourselves and ultimately it has to come in through the body. Um, we have to reconnect into our bodies and I'd say, if I could wish it to anyone, right, it is to build a connection with your body. However, it is that you can, because I think, even for me and I'm going to even say it this way, like I know, when I was anxious in my marriage, I knew I was, was anxious, but I didn't have the connection to, uh, the empowerment to do anything about it. Yeah, yeah, right, and I just felt anxious all the time and I didn't know why, but I always did. I was always anxious, like there was.
Speaker 1:I mean, I've gone from levels of anxiety where, when my when I first moved to Australia which would have been my, which would have been my ex-husband and I got together soon after I was scratching myself till I would bleed from anxiety.
Speaker 1:So when I think about the path I've come to where I am now to actually have this awareness, it's my like milestones, like I probably feel I feel the anxiety and I can feel all these things, but it's like I have the awareness that, okay, it's here and I can do something about this and I'm not gonna die. And how do I move this? And it really is like having the connection of what does it need right now? What does your body need right now? What does my heart need right now? What is my mind? What is the little girl inside of me that's really the one that's craving the attention and the love that I get to give to myself Right Cause this is where it is. When we come back to our own attachment, it's like I'm looking outside of me for everything, but really, carrie and you have no control over outside.
Speaker 2:So of course it creates anxiety because it's like I need all of you to make me feel safe, but I know I have no control over the choices and the things you do. It's like a looping knowing that I need you to keep me safe, but I know I can't make you do that. I can't.
Speaker 1:I can't trust you to actually do that, because people are going to change, because lives change. Yeah, right.
Speaker 2:And the way you navigate. That is to come back to I'm responsible for this and then when you understand the person responsible for your safety is the person you have control over, that changes that anxiety pattern, because the anxiety comes from not knowing if somebody outside of you is gonna show up in the way you need them to right, we just give it to ourselves and it's been the greatest thing.
Speaker 1:It's like anytime I want, not anytime I won't, because sometimes it is the other person when you are in a relationship right, yes, absolutely there is, there is need for this is we are in relationship, right yeah. But oftentimes I will ask myself first is this something I can give myself?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, and when I'm not, it's because I'm definitely in my not self or it's definitely because I'm in an anxious state and luckily I have beautiful friends and you know, people around me and even lovers, whatever. They're not going to be mad at me. They're not people who love you aren't going to be mad at you because you go into one of these states, right, like they're going to love you through it. Yeah, but yeah, I think it's a really important question that we start to ask ourselves is can I give? What can I? What do I need? What do I need to give myself in these moments? And it's not you be to get into that body of yours, move that body of yours in some way, shape or form, express it in some way, shape or form and do it in a way that's healthy for yourself and for the people around you, please.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:And I think to even just to kind of expand on the nuance of someone that loves you, someone that loves you that also is self-aware enough to understand what's going on in their body, because, yeah, like someone can love you very much, but if they don't know how to move their own trauma and their own, regulate their own nervous system, they can want all they want, but their body may not be able to show up in compassion or support. If it's true, if your trigger is triggering them yes, which happens a lot in especially romantic relationships- yes oh yeah, beautiful, beautiful discussion. Thank you for sharing your journey thank you.
Speaker 1:Anything else you want to add? No, no thanks see y'all next week, let us know. Let us know what you liked. Reach out, tell us the things you loved. We'd love to hear from you.
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